Curse

Life Bringing · Feb 28, 2011, 11:20 PM // 23:20

Kaida, for gods sake, stop posting shit about eles if you dont play ele. An ER is an extremely proficient tank, and in many areas it would be far superior to other options in terms of pulling. Hell, ER eles act as tanks in (legit)DoASCs.

loopysnoopy · Mar 01, 2011, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by loopysnoopy

Heros seem to lack the idea of what i was trying to achive at the moment my build won't work with out tweaking the MM and the rits MM i sorted by just giving Moti chants the Rit i'm thinking ranger/para and go beast maybe heros aint too daft to run that i hope.
Shame to as the builds was fun on paper but not in game

novawhiz · Mar 01, 2011, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rites

this will be what i will start with, will tweak as needed

IMO, doesnt seem like you have enough healing in this build. Monk bar also seems kinda funky with prot spirit thrown in there.

Condition/hex/aoe heavy areas will probably give this build a hard time. I think you need to consider adding another monk or rit or nec for support.

Also, is there any reason for the Charge warrior? you just like the party wide speed increase? cause the bar seems kinda useless.

Xenomortis · Mar 01, 2011, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Prot Spirit isn't the problem with the Monk bar; it's Rebirth and the total lack of energy management.
Also, 4 heals? Ok Dismiss is condition removal but that still leaves three pure heals!

novawhiz · Mar 01, 2011, 12:48 AM // 00:48

yeah and resurrect on the whamma is kind pointless.

Main thing i dont get is why he has 7 melee and 2 barragers but no support for the melee. No splinter, no mop, nothing. Im also not sure if i understand why you need barrage and volley. And maybe its just me, but barrage + pet combo seems a lil strange

Chthon · Mar 01, 2011, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Prot Spirit isn't the problem with the Monk bar; it's Rebirth and the total lack of energy management.
Also, 4 heals? Ok Dismiss is condition removal but that still leaves three pure heals!

Sig of Rejuv is e-management after a fashion. It's free heals on people who don't need immediate attention with an eye for not letting damage stack up enough to require a WoH or DKiss. Now, I'm not sure if the hero AI uses it like that though...

Rites · Mar 01, 2011, 05:00 AM // 05:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by novawhiz

IMO, doesnt seem like you have enough healing in this build. Monk bar also seems kinda funky with prot spirit thrown in there.

Condition/hex/aoe heavy areas will probably give this build a hard time. I think you need to consider adding another monk or rit or nec for support.

Also, is there any reason for the Charge warrior? you just like the party wide speed increase? cause the bar seems kinda useless.

i did say that i would have to tweak as needed

all these builds are currently on heros that i use now and have gotten me through the game with little tweaking

i never had to use more than 1 monk, and most of the time i use the henchie monk, so i dont see too much of an issue when the 7 hero update finally comes out

for hex heavy areas, i do have builds ready for some of my heros that i can switch to

Quote:

Originally Posted by novawhiz

yeah and resurrect on the whamma is kind pointless.

its just an extra rez

Quote:

Originally Posted by novawhiz

Main thing i dont get is why he has 2 melee, 2 pet and 2 barragers, 2 volley but no support for the melee. No splinter, no mop, nothing.

thus there is only 7 bars, i havent decided what the last hero would be yet

Quote:

Originally Posted by novawhiz

Im also not sure if i understand why you need barrage and volley. And maybe its just me, but barrage + pet combo seems a lil strange

barrage + volley is just my physical AoE spam, it works for me, as does the barrage/pet combo. the first ranger bar (barrage/pet) is the bar i have been using since i came back and has worked quite well for me. barrage and volley doesn't seem to scatter mobs in HM as much as AoE spells do.

**Marty Silverblade** · Mar 01, 2011, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rites

barrage + volley is just my physical AoE spam, it works for me, as does the barrage/pet combo. the first ranger bar (barrage/pet) is the bar i have been using since i came back and has worked quite well for me. barrage and volley doesn't seem to scatter mobs in HM as much as AoE spells do.

I think he meant that running Barrage and Volley on the same bar is pointless. You can use Barrage non-stop if you wanted to. Volley is redundant.

Also, just because no one else has said it yet, Barbarous Strike is terrible. There is no circumstance in which it should be used.

spray04 · Mar 01, 2011, 08:30 AM // 08:30

HigherMinion · Mar 01, 2011, 10:07 AM // 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by spray04

I don't understand the synergy.

You have Mark of Pain but you also take Barrage which hits MoP target once and the other foes for measly damage in comparison to, say, dual-shotting the MoP target.

To be honest, I was waiting for someone to post a discordway/spiritway hybrid team so I could post "Zzz"; and to top it off with a Panic mesmer; probably the most over-rated elite for a mesmer imo.

If you're running a necro, why not optimise your heroes for Mark of Pain triggers? After all, AoE wins the game.

Arrogant Bastard · Mar 01, 2011, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

@Jeydra:
Oddly enough, I'm betting I could kill Borguus with my Monitor off with an ER Prot Bond Ele and Burning Speed. Couldn't be too hard when the Mob's damage is capped at 25'ish, but i digress.

Also, suddenly I'm the badguy because you've found an exception? Please, put me on ignore. It makes no difference to me; it's your loss really. You seem to be stuck on me reinventing the wheel when I have stated clearly that I have friends, in addition to my own personal related experiences, that can simply tell me these things.

Experience tells me (and everyone else in the universe) your backline doesn't need to be getting hit. It's ALWAYS been that way in both PvE and PvP. You gain nothing by having your backline wailed on in place of your front or mid line. It causes errors. Errors lead to deaths. Six years of Guildwars has told the community: Keep the monks (backline) safe. Are you really trying to tell me the Ele is somehow excluded?

@Arrogant:
Uh, didn't I just tell you that I have buds that run them?
"What do I need to test? I've got buds who actually rolled Ele's. I've seen it happen. Dunno why I need to bother reinventing the wheel when they have the info already."

I'll just ignore the fact that we are talking about a character build that relies 100% on, and cannot function without, a single enchantment. Enchantment removal isn't the only threat to backline characters.

My argument is pretty legitimate: The backline should stay safe. Call me an idiot, but I think it's called the backline for a reason. It's you that are telling me (and 6 years of consensus by the entire GW population) that letting your healers get hit is okay. What?

@All:
But seriously, I appreciate the advice, but I'll have to keep my terrible, inexperienced opinions in this instance. This thread is derailing.

Physway: DB Sin vs. Dervish, which to run? Both are pretty, not sure which I should run.

I did specify "decent" ER eles.

AndrewSX · Mar 01, 2011, 10:51 AM // 10:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by spray04

What i can't understand at all is why with all the GW universe of possible builds you putted D-way in a 7 heroes setup. I mean, it is bad alone, in a team without any sense is......meh.

Daesu · Mar 01, 2011, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

To be honest, I was waiting for someone to post a discordway/spiritway hybrid team so I could post "Zzz";

There is not a lot of obvious synergy between discordway and spiritway besides painful bond and shadowsong. There is also not much synergy between the discord necros in standard discordway, once you have the pre-conditions for discord, besides soul reaping energy anyway. The best "synergy" between the two is the fact that spirits are cast-and-forget while discord should be spammed when its pre-conditions are met.

I don't see much of a point in using discord unless I am using a character that applies these pre-conditions readily.

spray04 · Mar 01, 2011, 09:40 PM // 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

I don't understand the synergy.

You have Mark of Pain but you also take Barrage which hits MoP target once and the other foes for measly damage in comparison to, say, dual-shotting the MoP target.

To be honest, I was waiting for someone to post a discordway/spiritway hybrid team so I could post "Zzz"; and to top it off with a Panic mesmer; probably the most over-rated elite for a mesmer imo.

If you're running a necro, why not optimise your heroes for Mark of Pain triggers? After all, AoE wins the game.

Barrage is synergy with splinter weapon + builds adrenaline. Minions trigger MoP. Anyway, all the "ways" together make a nice defensive build, I like defense in hard mode. I also enjoy having an army of minions + spirits, just how I like to play.

distilledwill · Mar 02, 2011, 09:45 AM // 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by spray04

Barrage is synergy with splinter weapon + builds adrenaline. Minions trigger MoP. Anyway, all the "ways" together make a nice defensive build, I like defense in hard mode. I also enjoy having an army of minions + spirits, just how I like to play.

Don't worry about it Spray - people are rather touchy about Discord builds because its a quick and easy way to score kills in HM. It will work just fine.

If you are using Rit heals like Spirit Light and Mend Body and Soul then they will benefit from having the extra spirits from your Rits. The only hero I think you could swap out is the Barrager - bearing in mind that hes the only physical attacker - I'd be temped to put something else in there and just stick "Fall Back" on their bar to increase movement speed.

HigherMinion · Mar 02, 2011, 09:50 AM // 09:50

Should change one of the discord healers and make it N/P for Fall Back and take better heals on another character.

aspi · Mar 02, 2011, 10:00 AM // 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

I think he meant that running Barrage and Volley on the same bar is pointless. You can use Barrage non-stop if you wanted to. Volley is redundant.

There is one place I can think of, nightfallen jahai, where you cannot spam barrage, only there it makes sense to bring both

I kinda agree with minion(did I just say that out loud?) it makes no sense to run a discord 7 hero party. It works almost the same with the 3 discord heroes and henchmen, I would go AoE with the 7 heros besides my fun builds. I just hope the melee update for heroes is enough for me to bring melee again.

Vallen · Mar 02, 2011, 12:40 PM // 12:40

I have given up on bashing discordway, bad players will just use it to stumble through the game. True it will get you through but not as effectively as a better setup would and im only talking 3 hero teams. With 7 hero teams using discordway is madness, but im sure the good players will put some nice 7 man hero teams on pvxwiki and all the discord noobs will change to that one.

Physway with SoH, MoP, orders with some para support instagibbing mobs will be my main build id imagine. Killing entire mobs in 1 go > killing single targets

Kaida the Heartless · Mar 02, 2011, 07:32 PM // 19:32

@LifeBringing:
Yea, another exception. DoA is nothing but LOLDAMAGE with the rare Mesmer here and there. It's a very bad idea to tank more balanced mobs, such as those in Slavers or even larger Char groups. Why does my Ele need to tank? What could possibly require more than 500hp/sec (infuse) to pull? Did people forget about longbows and start hi-fiving the enemy?

@Arrogant:
Your name is fitting. I've no way to prove what I would say next, so I'll let you think you're accomplishing something if it'll shut you up. I've already stated that my Ele is staying in my backline, so I'm not sure why you are still talking.

@All:
I could see Discord use if I feel like tab spacing through a Dungeon or something. The fact that you would be able to synergize the rest of the team with Discord is a plus. I'd leave Physway for when I need to get through something really fast or difficult, or when I am generally in a more "active" sort of move. Haven't met anyone that doesn't like the yellow numbers spamming across the screen.

Life Bringing · Mar 02, 2011, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Stygian hungers